Glossary entry (derived from question below)
French term or phrase:
à bon ouvrier, bon outil
English translation:
to a good workman, a good set of tools
French term
á bon ouvrier, bon outil
Aug 6, 2008 16:33: Carlos Soares da Silva changed "Level" from "Non-PRO" to "PRO"
Jan 14, 2011 12:58: Stéphanie Soudais changed "Edited KOG entry" from "<a href="/profile/33515">Julie Allison's</a> old entry - "á bon ouvrier, bon outil"" to ""To a good workman, a good set of tools (in this context)""
PRO (3): Sébastien Ricciardi, Tony M, Carlos Soares da Silva
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Proposed translations
A good workman always has good tools
I think that this is the meaning.
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Note added at 5 hrs (2008-08-06 21:24:49 GMT)
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I was reading into it too much and got confused.
Look at it this way
À Bon ouvrier = to the good workman
bon outil = good set of tools
To (every) good workman comes a good set of tools
I hope that helps.
a good workman doesn't need to blame his tools / all tools are good in the hands of a good workman
It might help us if we knew just what context it was being used in?
It seems to me as if the writer may have deliberately modified the usual expression in order to make some specific point.
There is also another expression 'à bon chat, bon rat', which sort of means 'the biter bit' — possibly the parallel with that expression was also intentional, who can tell?
agree |
Carlos Soares da Silva
: I took 1 minute more than you because I tried to find a reference. Nice answer Tony ! ;-)
4 mins
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Thanks, Carlos!
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agree |
kashew
: [All these dolly-birds translating these days!]
14 mins
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Thanks, J! [What IS the world coming to?!]
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agree |
Helen Shiner
: Agree with your first suggestion, but I feel the second has a different meaning from the source.
36 mins
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Thanks, Helen! Yes, it does, doesn't it? ... that's what I remarked about Matt's answer too, and I really don't feel that reflects the intended meaning here.
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agree |
liz askew
42 mins
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Thanks, Liz!
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agree |
Rachel Fell
: what was coming to my mind too, but context'd be nice - usually v. mutually helpful;-)
6 hrs
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Thanks, Rachel! Yes, indeed! ;-)
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A workman is as good as his tools
A méchant ouvrier, point de bon outil.
In English
A bad workman blames his tools.
or A bad workman quarrels with his tools
"It is of course a fact that some people will blame their failings wherever they can and this saying has some validity, yet anyone who does practical work soon discovers the importance of good, well maintained tools. So a saying such as "a good workman is highly critical of the state of his tools and makes sure he has the best" would be quite appropriate! It could be that this saying was originated by disgruntled employers whose miserly nature meant their work people had to make do with rubbish equipment. A good workman with bad tools will struggle to do a good job; a bad workman will do a bad job even with good tools - and probably damage them in the process!"
Similar sayings could be :
" A workman is as good as his tools"
" A good worker does not quarrel with his tools"
neutral |
Tony M
: I'd love to return your kindness and give you an 'agree' here, but I do have slight reservations; the trouble with modifying the std exp; in this way is that it tend to suggest '...is ONLY as good as...', which I don't think is the intention...?
29 mins
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fair enough. Had an hesitation here with : A good worker does not quarrel with his tools. Thanks Tony
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A skilled craftsman can work with bad tools
My try...
neutral |
Tony M
: I certainly agree with the translation idea, though I don't somehow agree with the saying, do you? It's certainly not always true!
20 mins
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You have a valid point here. The more I think about it, the more I doubt it. I think it means "A good workman always has good tools". I think that's the idea.
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the right tools for the right job
http://rb-aa.bosch.com/bosch/infotech/fr-BE/presstext.cfm?CF...
The Dutch version of this site uses: Goed gereedschap is het halve werk
the right man for the (right) job
You say they describe the cellar and then mention the master; perhaps this could follow.
Discussion
P.S. I had no idea people still used phrases like "dolly birds" ;()
Thanks everyone.