| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10] > | Cultural difference leads to poppycock? （几个单词的翻译） Thread poster: Alan Wang
|
|---|
Alan Wang 
China
Local time: 00:47
English to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
首先，我不是来此传播福音的。 请不要误会。
有人说，二楼不好，非要提一楼才合原文，好的，这里是块糖果。
你现在去东北灾区，问受灾的老大娘，她会告诉你二楼比一楼安全。你问任何从事防洪专业的人，他也会这样告诉你。
从语言上分析，地面只有一层是 on the ground level，其它楼层才是 above ground lev... See more 首先，我不是来此传播福音的。 请不要误会。
有人说，二楼不好，非要提一楼才合原文，好的，这里是块糖果。
你现在去东北灾区，问受灾的老大娘，她会告诉你二楼比一楼安全。你问任何从事防洪专业的人，他也会这样告诉你。
从语言上分析，地面只有一层是 on the ground level，其它楼层才是 above ground level （除了特殊情境如 Phi Hand 所举的例子中，后者可以理解为包括地面一层）。这里的“其它楼层”除了二楼以上还能是什么呢？。
另外，我说过了，我翻译此类文件几年了。内容重复率极高。类似的所谓知识点几乎能倒背如流。这些知识点就包括：为防洪需要把重要设备移到二楼或以上楼层。所以这对我来说，只是重复过去翻译类似文件所得到的这些知识而已。不是下套子，不是要和谁排输赢。
我还可以给一个糖果，如果有人再说一楼。:grin:
ysun wrote: Alan Wang wrote:
Common sense
Relocate all critical equipment from low-lying basement areas to floors above ground level (floor).
It’s not really necessary to add the last word.
What is necessary here is the translator’s common sense.
经过几天讨论已经十分清楚，是你自己主观地、错误地认为 ground level 就是 ground floor。大多数同仁都认为，ground level 就是 the level of the ground，更别提你所谓的“年挣几十万上百万的翻译界大佬、联合国高翻等大人物”了。不过，你认为是“学龄前儿童都应该知道的”事情，恐怕不一定每个成年人都知道。如果你的观点只遭到一、两人反对，那也应该认真听取。如果遭到这么多人反对，最好还是慎重考虑一下。否则，你还拿出来讨论是什么目的呢？ 通常，作为一名翻译，如果不能理解原文，可以去问客户，而不要轻易按自己的理解改动原文。也许有人认为上述原文写得不好，但我认为写得很好，体现了工程技术人员的精确语言。我尤其欣赏作者在 floors 一词上使用复数。这说明作者已经考虑到了各种可能性，例如建筑物所处位置和高度以及海啸、江河决堤等情况，从而提供了较多选项。没有经历过海啸、江河决堤的人，起码也应该从电视新闻里看见过。由此看来，作者并非是由于疏忽而使用 “ground level”一词。作者想表达的就是 “the level of the ground around the building”，而不是 "ground floor"。 我的很多客户都要求，即使翻译人员百分之百地肯定原文有误，那也照翻不误，但可加上 Translator’s notes。因为很多已经发行的文件，尤其是专利，不是一两个人说改就可以改的。这应该成为 “translator’s common sense”。 ▲ Collapse
| | | | nigerose
China
Local time: 00:47
Chinese to English
+ ...
人有高度，从而一楼也需要有高度，一楼已经是above ground level了。
| | | | ysun
United States
Local time: 11:47
English to Chinese
+ ...
Alan Wang wrote: 首先，我不是来此传播福音的。 请不要误会。 有人说，二楼不好，非要提一楼才合原文，好的，这里是块糖果。 你现在去东北灾区，问受灾的老大娘，她会告诉你二楼比一楼安全。你问任何从事防洪专业的人，他也会这样告诉你。 从语言上分析，地面只有一层是 on the ground level，其它楼层才是 above ground level （除了特殊情境如 Phi Hand 所举的例子中，后者可以理解为包括地面一层）。这里的“其它楼层”除了二楼以上还能是什么呢？。 另外，我说过了，我翻译此类文件几年了。内容重复率极高。类似的所谓知识点几乎能倒背如流。这些知识点就包括：为防洪需要把重要设备移到二楼或以上楼层。所以这对我来说，只是重复过去翻译类似文件所得到的这些知识而已。不是下套子，不是要和谁排输赢。 我还可以给一个糖果，如果有人再说一楼。:grin:
翻译只能按照原文，不能随心所欲。如果可以随心所欲，那么也许楼顶最安全。
看来你是没见过远高于 ground level 的 ground floor。你什么时候来美国，我带你去看看华盛顿的白宫和国会大厦。如果你没机会来美国，那也不要紧，可以去看看北京的人民大会堂。如果理解原文还有困难，那就看图吧：
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a3/United_States_Capitol_west_front_edit2.jpg
[Edited at 2013-09-04 00:25 GMT]
| | | | Rita Pang
Canada
Local time: 12:47
Member (2011)
Chinese to English
+ ...
Moderator of this forum | Your logic is, well, logical | Sep 3, 2013 |
Alan Wang wrote: 首先，我不是来此传播福音的。 请不要误会。 有人说，二楼不好，非要提一楼才合原文，好的，这里是块糖果。 你现在去东北灾区，问受灾的老大娘，她会告诉你二楼比一楼安全。你问任何从事防洪专业的人，他也会这样告诉你。 从语言上分析，地面只有一层是 on the ground level，其它楼层才是 above ground level （除了特殊情境如 Phi Hand 所举的例子中，后者可以理解为包括地面一层）。这里的“其它楼层”除了二楼以上还能是什么呢？。
I can most definitely understand where you are coming from- however, that is not our job to decide. Overriding errors made in the source are only acceptable in certain occasions, and in this case I think Ysun's earlier suggestion of including "translators' notes" work best. Depending on the type of content, patents and other published articles assign the right of editorial/changes to the author alone, so even though we KNOW something is wrong and needs to be corrected, one simply cannot make changes as is seen fit in these scenarios.
p.s. if my comment here sounds off-topic in response to your quote above, it's simply because I am writing a general reply to the ongoing conversations within this particular thread.
| | |
|
|
|
nigerose
China
Local time: 00:47
Chinese to English
+ ...
| floors above ground level，floors below ground level，above-ground height | Sep 3, 2013 |
10. Number of Floors Above Ground Level
11. Number of Floors Below Ground Level
http://www.wescofire.org/wp-content/uploads/Wesco-permit-plans-requirements-April-2013.pdf
Diamond of Istanbul is the tallest building under construction in Istanbul, Turkey, being built in the city's Maslak central business district. It is als... See more 10. Number of Floors Above Ground Level
11. Number of Floors Below Ground Level
http://www.wescofire.org/wp-content/uploads/Wesco-permit-plans-requirements-April-2013.pdf
Diamond of Istanbul is the tallest building under construction in Istanbul, Turkey, being built in the city's Maslak central business district. It is also the country's first steel skyscraper.
When completed, it will rise 53 floors above ground level and reach an above-ground height of 270 meters; thus surpassing the current tallest skyscraper in Istanbul, the 261 m (54 floors) Istanbul Sapphire in Levent.
The complex also has a five-floor parking garage situated in the bottom-most basement floors of the building (with a total of eight basement floors below ground level.)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diamond_of_Istanbul ▲ Collapse
| | | | nigerose
China
Local time: 00:47
Chinese to English
+ ...
| | 荷尽已无擎雨盖，菊残犹有傲霜枝。一年好景君须记，正是橙黄橘绿时。 | Sep 5, 2013 |
先奉上几只甜梨，劝众乡亲莫忘秋季养生之学，达观淡泊，免秋燥之苦。 学术讨论间有时难免会上火，这却也体现出诸位对文字的执着态度。Alan Wang先生您提出了个极好的问题，我个人则赞同Ysun先生的见解，感觉讨论至此，和该问题相关的那些部分诸位着实阐述得很清楚，尤其感谢Ysun先生图文并茂的讲解！与大家同享金秋好时节！
| | | | Alan Wang
China
Local time: 00:47
English to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | That's a very cute idea | Sep 5, 2013 |
But it's not always cute to be doing things by the book.
Sometimes you'd have the crazy idea, well, let's see what happens if I do it this way.
How do I know I was not being tested and my reaction proved to be kicking the ball to the next in line.
Actually, one or two days later, I did notice that there was one more recruiting ad.
Perhaps this is just my imgaination, although i can't help to associate these together.
Rita Pang wrote: I can most definitely understand where you are coming from- however, that is not our job to decide. Overriding errors made in the source are only acceptable in certain occasions, and in this case I think Ysun's earlier suggestion of including "translators' notes" work best. Depending on the type of content, patents and other published articles assign the right of editorial/changes to the author alone, so even though we KNOW something is wrong and needs to be corrected, one simply cannot make changes as is seen fit in these scenarios. p.s. if my comment here sounds off-topic in response to your quote above, it's simply because I am writing a general reply to the ongoing conversations within this particular thread.
| | |
|
|
|
Alan Wang
China
Local time: 00:47
English to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
谢谢美女上来捧场。
Ysun先生当然是老当益壮，非常可信，甚至值得盲从。
As I have said, I am not here to propagate gospel. There is absolutely no consequences for anyone to stick to their own faith. No hell, no purgatory, no nothing.
I'd even encourage any one for believing in what they believe with a candystick.
Meixia Jordan wrote:
先奉上几只甜梨，劝众乡亲莫忘秋季养生之学，达观淡泊，免秋燥之苦。 学术讨论间有时难免会上火，这却也体现出诸位对文字的执着态度。Alan Wang先生您提出了个极好的问题，我个人则赞同Ysun先生的见解，感觉讨论至此，和该问题相关的那些部分诸位着实阐述得很清楚，尤其感谢Ysun先生图文并茂的讲解！与大家同享金秋好时节！
| | | |
老当益壮好啊！经验和知识真的靠岁月积累，我记得我刚参加工作，参与顾客会议的时候总是穿着得特别正式，甚至做出蛮严肃的样子，老是担心自己年轻，经验不够，是否为顾客树立了一个professional的印象。年长的人则再不必装老，而可卖老啦！多好！至于是否是盲从，如果在您的下一轮讨论中，我与您的见解相同，我也一定盲从您一回！
| | | | ysun
United States
Local time: 11:47
English to Chinese
+ ...
Meixia Jordan wrote:
先奉上几只甜梨，劝众乡亲莫忘秋季养生之学，达观淡泊，免秋燥之苦。 学术讨论间有时难免会上火，这却也体现出诸位对文字的执着态度。Alan Wang先生您提出了个极好的问题，我个人则赞同Ysun先生的见解，感觉讨论至此，和该问题相关的那些部分诸位着实阐述得很清楚，尤其感谢Ysun先生图文并茂的讲解！与大家同享金秋好时节！
Meixia ：
谢谢你的理解和支持！其实我只是在 J.H. Wang、lbone、Zhou Xianlian、Yan Yuliang (just to name a few) 等同仁的意见基础上表示自己的赞同且略加解释而已。我相信，经过几天的讨论，上述各位同仁的见解已经足以获得绝大部分参与者和旁观者的理解和赞同。我无意也没必要说服任何听不得不同意见、只听得见赞同意见的人。
预祝你和大家中秋节快乐！
| | | | ysun
United States
Local time: 11:47
English to Chinese
+ ...
| Critical equipment | Sep 5, 2013 |
Zhou, Xianlian wrote:
而且根据经验，很少听说哪台技术设备不能安装在一楼的！否则很多用户都不能买了，因为厂房、实验室大部分是在一楼。
显然，Zhou Xianlian 是一位既有工程技术背景又有实践经验的翻译。
Critical equipment 不是东北灾区老大娘家的老玉米棒子，不是想搬几楼就几楼、甚至还可以撂房顶的。看看这张照片就明白了（不用说，安装时还得砌一个混凝土基座）：
P.S.: “Cultural difference leads to poppycock?” I don't think so. If poppycock does exist, it is not due to cultural difference. It is due to lack of basic engineering concepts, lack of industrial experiences and lack of common sense.
| | |
|
|
|
wherestip
United States
Local time: 11:47
Chinese to English
+ ...
ysun wrote:
不是东北灾区老大娘家的老玉米棒子
... neither soybeans nor sorghum.
[Edited at 2013-09-06 02:07 GMT]
| | | | Phil Hand
China
Local time: 00:47
Chinese to English
Zhou, Xianlian wrote:
而且根据经验，很少听说哪台技术设备不能安装在一楼的！否则很多用户都不能买了，因为厂房、实验室大部分是在一楼。
Alan的原文跟美国有关吧？看看美国联邦紧急事务管理局怎么说：
http://www.fema.gov/media-library-data/20130726-1906-25045-2736/sandy_ra2_critical_facilities_final_508.pdf
Major components of essential systems and equipment are frequently placed on the lowest floors or subgrade (basement) levels...
The most effective mitigation method is to elevate all essential equipment above the highest anticipated flood elevation...elevating typically requires relocating the equipment to higher floors in the building.
Building owners may need to evaluate all available space, including the attic and second floor...
鉴于洪水的最高水位肯定在地平面以上，为了挪到水高位以上，必定要选择二楼，除非是ysun说的那种高架一层外。
| | | | Rita Pang
Canada
Local time: 12:47
Member (2011)
Chinese to English
+ ...
Moderator of this forum | I don't appreciate being called "cute" when I am being 100% serious | Sep 6, 2013 |
Alan Wang wrote: But it's not always cute to be doing things by the book. Sometimes you'd have the crazy idea, well, let's see what happens if I do it this way. How do I know I was not being tested and my reaction proved to be kicking the ball to the next in line. Actually, one or two days later, I did notice that there was one more recruiting ad. Perhaps this is just my imgaination, although i can't help to associate these together. Rita Pang wrote:
I can most definitely understand where you are coming from- however, that is not our job to decide. Overriding errors made in the source are only acceptable in certain occasions, and in this case I think Ysun's earlier suggestion of including "translators' notes" work best. Depending on the type of content, patents and other published articles assign the right of editorial/changes to the author alone, so even though we KNOW something is wrong and needs to be corrected, one simply cannot make changes as is seen fit in these scenarios.
I appreciate your POV, Alan, and I am not here to "take" any one's side on things. Your finesse in your work, your language capabilities and your attention to detail certainly comes out in your persistence in your viewpoints, as can be seen in many of this forum's threads. I admit, hands down, that I still have A LOT to learn on this career path, so my suggestions or methods are not always good suggestions That being said, however, I'll like to suggest the following to you: don't use words lightly. Calling others poppycock or dismissing a fellow translator's very serious suggestion as "cute" is one of the most disrespectful things you can do to a fellow forum participant.
In trans-creation projects you'll likely have a lot more liberty to try things out, so yes, you are right, "crazy ideas" can most certainly be entertained, welcomed or even encouraged. Please note that I am not here to oppose any of your ideas/suggestions. I have a lot of respect for everyone here on this forum and I always support a fellow translator's right in asserting their own way of work - we can all conclude, without a doubt, how important it is sometimes to push back a client's suggestion! So likewise I sincerely ask you to extend this same courtesy to myself. I am merely bringing out a suggestion, and you are most certainly free to agree or disagree. However, don't diss someone's serious approach in work with a simple wave of your hand. I'd like to think that you really don't mean it; but if you do, well, please try not to do it again.
Have yourself a nice day!
[Edited at 2013-09-06 02:23 GMT]
| | | | | Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10] > | To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator: You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request » Cultural difference leads to poppycock? （几个单词的翻译） | CafeTran Espresso | You've never met a CAT tool this clever!
Translate faster & easier, using a sophisticated CAT tool built by a translator / developer.
Accept jobs from clients who use Trados, MemoQ, Wordfast & major CAT tools.
Download and start using CafeTran Espresso -- for free
Buy now! » |
| | TM-Town | Manage your TMs and Terms ... and boost your translation business
Are you ready for something fresh in the industry? TM-Town is a unique new site for you -- the freelance translator -- to store, manage and share translation memories (TMs) and glossaries...and potentially meet new clients on the basis of your prior work.
More info » |
|
| | | | X Sign in to your ProZ.com account... | | | | | |
Login to reply/comment 
