| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5] | 76 offers (and growing!) for 0.04 euro /word on proZ?? Thread poster: Luca Tutino
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Nathalie Suteau (X)
United Kingdom
Local time: 07:40
English to French
| I'm receiving work for 4 persons | Mar 30, 2011 |
Hello,
I'm a EN=>FR translator with 15 years of experience. I work with 3 different agencies and my schedule is always full, I have to constantly turn down projects. I think I could offer work for at least 3-4 other persons. And my rates are high: I checked Proz rates and I'm in the upper bracket. The quality of my work is good and my customers have known me for a long time but the three of them lack resources. I really don't understand why some translators accept such low rates whe... See more Hello,
I'm a EN=>FR translator with 15 years of experience. I work with 3 different agencies and my schedule is always full, I have to constantly turn down projects. I think I could offer work for at least 3-4 other persons. And my rates are high: I checked Proz rates and I'm in the upper bracket. The quality of my work is good and my customers have known me for a long time but the three of them lack resources. I really don't understand why some translators accept such low rates when major agencies have a complete lack of resources - at least for EN to FR, it may be different for other languages.
Nevertheles, a long, long time ago, I used to operate as an agency so I could allocate my extra workload to other translators. I had to give up this operation: none of the translators I found produced the required quality. The cheapest even produce a translation I had to re-start from scratch. I had to ask him why his translation was so poor and he told that he likes to work with agencies offering low rates - 0.03 euros - and produce poor quality with a pace of 10,000 words a day. These agencies were happy with his work.
My conclusion is that, at least for EN==FR, there are two markets: one with high rates for serious translators producing a good level of quality and one we could called "low-cost" in which translators offer cheap rate but translate very fast and very poorly. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Adrian Grant 
United Kingdom
Local time: 07:40
Portuguese to English
+ ...
| Cat's done a whoopsie | Mar 31, 2011 |
I was contacted yesterday by a Spanish agency requesting collaboration, so I emailed them my CV and rates.
The reply I got was (translated):
"Thanks Betty for your quick response.
Our usual working rate is 0.04 Euros, would that be possible?"
By incorrectly calling me Betty, it crossed my mind that perhaps Frank Spencer has set up his own translation agency.
I mean, by now, he's probably tried everything else poor soul, so maybe I should give hi... See more I was contacted yesterday by a Spanish agency requesting collaboration, so I emailed them my CV and rates.
The reply I got was (translated):
"Thanks Betty for your quick response.
Our usual working rate is 0.04 Euros, would that be possible?"
By incorrectly calling me Betty, it crossed my mind that perhaps Frank Spencer has set up his own translation agency.
I mean, by now, he's probably tried everything else poor soul, so maybe I should give him a break. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Arcatrad
Belgium
Local time: 08:40
Member (2010)
English to French
+ ...
| Who dares to work for 0.03 €/word ??? | Mar 31, 2011 |
After having applied to a job offer on this ProZ site, I have been contacted and submitted a short translation test. The next day, they told me I successfully passed the test (did they really correct it?) and I received a contract to complete, sign and return to them. Hopefully I read it carefully before sending...
They offered me a rate of 0.03 €/word! I contacted them but they said it was "non-negotiable" (sic.).
Why do some translators still accept such low rates?... See more After having applied to a job offer on this ProZ site, I have been contacted and submitted a short translation test. The next day, they told me I successfully passed the test (did they really correct it?) and I received a contract to complete, sign and return to them. Hopefully I read it carefully before sending...
They offered me a rate of 0.03 €/word! I contacted them but they said it was "non-negotiable" (sic.).
Why do some translators still accept such low rates? They're breaking the market and I have huge doubts on the final quality of such a bad paid job... ▲ Collapse
| | | | Adam Jarczyk
Poland
Local time: 08:40
Member (2009)
English to Polish
+ ...
| I guess you may have turned down the same outsourcer as I some time earlier... | Mar 31, 2011 |
Arcatrad wrote:
After having applied to a job offer on this ProZ site, I have been contacted and submitted a short translation test. The next day, they told me I successfully passed the test (did they really correct it?) and I received a contract to complete, sign and return to them. Hopefully I read it carefully before sending...
They offered me a rate of 0.03 €/word! I contacted them but they said it was "non-negotiable" (sic.).
Why do some translators still accept such low rates? They're breaking the market and I have huge doubts on the final quality of such a bad paid job...
... as the whole procedure that you described as well as the offered "non-negotiable" rate fit exactly my previous experience.
Yes, I agree, it is a shame that there are translators who would accept to work under such conditions for a Western European outsourcer (provided we are talking of the same offer) - but then, isn't it already a good sign that obviously there are not too many skilled translators lining up to be allowed to work for them, at least not enough to fully cover their needs?
If I am not mistaken, said offer has been placed several times in the not-too-distant past, and not only on the proZ.com job list but on similar platforms, too. So the response does not seem to be fully satisfactory.
Just FYI and for others to know as well - maybe there IS hope, actually, at least when it comes to colleagues who can deliver quality jobs.
Kind regards,
Adam
Adam Jarczyk
[email protected]
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veratek
Brazil
Local time: 03:40
French to English
+ ...
| my impression too | Mar 31, 2011 |
artfully wrote:
My conclusion is that, at least for EN==FR, there are two markets: one with high rates for serious translators producing a good level of quality and one we could called "low-cost" in which translators offer cheap rate but translate very fast and very poorly.
I have the same impression that we can divide the market basically into two almost distinct spheres. However, quite often, translation timeframes can also be very short even though being high end. And the very fast, cheaper translations are not necessarily always very poor. I imagine though, that there is great variance regarding quality and a much greater tolerance for errors.
This is just a great lead-in for one my favorite gripes: why won't clients plan their documentation needs in a saner way? I would wager that half of rush jobs, which really do have a short deadline, could have been normal jobs, if clients were obliged to work this way. But they know the can always find someone to do their rush jobs, and so they abuse the process over and over again.
| | | | Therrien
Canada
Local time: 00:40
English to French
+ ...
I can picture a college kid accepting such rate. Or a caregiver surrounded by kids with a few hours to spare. There is a market for part-timers the real world, the same exists on the internet.
I don't sneer at people accepting miserable rates. The agency/client knows the market, which kind of provider will accept this rate, that's just what they want. That's OK.
Now someone might retort with the broken window fallacy, but after a co. has bumped its nose on bad product... See more I can picture a college kid accepting such rate. Or a caregiver surrounded by kids with a few hours to spare. There is a market for part-timers the real world, the same exists on the internet.
I don't sneer at people accepting miserable rates. The agency/client knows the market, which kind of provider will accept this rate, that's just what they want. That's OK.
Now someone might retort with the broken window fallacy, but after a co. has bumped its nose on bad products they will search for more quality translators. That's when you shine your shoes and your smiles and provide what you do.
There will always be bargain shoppers. They've been around since money existed (literally). They make us look good.
[Edited at 2011-03-31 19:45 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | veratek
Brazil
Local time: 03:40
French to English
+ ...
| Exactly - so obvious | Mar 31, 2011 |
Therrien wrote:
I can picture a college kid accepting such rate. Or a caregiver surrounded by kids with a few hours to spare. There is a market for part-timers the real world, the same exists on the internet.
Exactly, it's so obvious.
Very similar to a conversation I had with two French upper-middle-class boys this week. They started going into a tirade about how horrible "all" immigrants were in France, and that their "pure, pristine" France was being invaded by hordes of such people, etc etc. Then they added that (basically) all the kids in their class have immigrant maids, and what a good thing it was, because they would never do their work themselves.
| | | | LEXpert
United States
Local time: 01:40
Member (2008)
Croatian to English
+ ...
| @Veratek - good point about crazy deadlines | Mar 31, 2011 |
[quote]veratek wrote:
artfully wrote:
This is just a great lead-in for one my favorite gripes: why won't clients plan their documentation needs in a saner way? I would wager that half of rush jobs, which really do have a short deadline, could have been normal jobs, if clients were obliged to work this way. But they know the can always find someone to do their rush jobs, and so they abuse the process over and over again.
That's really an excellent question - where do all the insane deadlines come from? Do all end clients just happen to know that their requested deadline - every time - is just barely adequate if a translator drops everything else and does nothing but that project at an above-average pace, working continuously, including evenings and weekends? What are the odds?? I don't think that all end clients are really so disorganized that every single translation request is made at the last possible moment, even if that seems to be the case. It probably has more to do with the commodification of the profession - hardly anybody every asks translators "What would your rate be for this specific job and when can you deliver?"; they just field the inquiry from the end client, plug the parameters into their magic price/time/turnaround calculator, reply to the end client with a quote, and send out an e-mail with the pre-set specifications to their database, knowing that one or probably several people won't have anything else to do at the moment.
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Therrien
Canada
Local time: 00:40
English to French
+ ...
| You're misunderstanding me... | Mar 31, 2011 |
veratek wrote: Therrien wrote:
I can picture a college kid accepting such rate. Or a caregiver surrounded by kids with a few hours to spare. There is a market for part-timers the real world, the same exists on the internet.
Exactly, it's so obvious. Very similar to a conversation I had with two French upper-middle-class boys this week. They started going into a tirade about how horrible "all" immigrants were in France, and that their "pure, pristine" France was being invaded by hordes of such people, etc etc. Then they added that (basically) all the kids in their class have immigrant maids, and what a good thing it was, because they would never do their work themselves.
I don't mean to throw table scraps to the less fortunate, I mean there are people that prefer that kind of setup. When I was a student I hauled drywall up staircases in the morning, studied at night and had a few piano gigs o'er the weekend. That was my lifestyle. There are plenty of schedules and lifestyles, thus plenty of markets available.
Play nice.
[Edited at 2011-03-31 23:22 GMT]
| | | | veratek
Brazil
Local time: 03:40
French to English
+ ...
| I think you are misunderstanding me | Apr 1, 2011 |
Therrien wrote: veratek wrote: Therrien wrote:
I can picture a college kid accepting such rate. Or a caregiver surrounded by kids with a few hours to spare. There is a market for part-timers the real world, the same exists on the internet.
Exactly, it's so obvious. Very similar to a conversation I had with two French upper-middle-class boys this week. They started going into a tirade about how horrible "all" immigrants were in France, and that their "pure, pristine" France was being invaded by hordes of such people, etc etc. Then they added that (basically) all the kids in their class have immigrant maids, and what a good thing it was, because they would never do their work themselves. I don't mean to throw table scraps to the less fortunate, I mean there are people that prefer that kind of setup. When I was a student I hauled drywall up staircases in the morning, studied at night and had a few piano gigs o'er the weekend. That was my lifestyle. There are plenty of schedules and lifestyles, thus plenty of markets available. [Edited at 2011-03-31 23:22 GMT]
It seems you didn't understand at all my comment about it being so obvious that there would be plenty of people in an array of different situations who would certainly accept low rates. This was what I understood you were pointing out: it's not because someone accepts a low rate that they are low rate themselves, that they are stupid/ignorant or that their work quality must be low rate.
Something along these lines was claimed by several posters, such as:
\"Translators\" bidding that low simply know nothing about market prices, cash flow management, SWOT-analyses, marketing, time consumption and quality.
1. Everybody agreed that 0.04 /word is not a viable fee for a translator living in Western Europe or North America.
Why do some translators still accept such low rates? They're breaking the market and I have huge doubts on the final quality of such a bad paid job...
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I think people who are automatically slamming translators who accept low rates as bad professionals are indeed as clueless as the two boys I described.
"I don't mean to throw table scraps to the less fortunate,"
In case you think I was implying you want to do the above, you didn't understand my comment.
" I mean there are people that prefer that kind of setup."
In my opinion, there are some who may have a choice, but most simply do not. On our planet, mostly what the less fortunate get is scraps. And occasionally when their reality surfaces into the world of the privileged, it upsets the "have's." Whether you personally agree or disagree with this larger picture does not change it for what it is on a global level. Neither will it change fundamental mechanisms of a market economy, nor the fact that in plenty of situations, topmost quality is less of a priority than price.
"Play nice."
There was nothing personally directed at you, so I can only imagine you said the above because you misunderstood what I was pointing out.
| | | | | deadlines of that kind | Apr 2, 2011 |
Rudolf Vedo CT wrote:
That's really an excellent question - where do all the insane deadlines come from?
insane deadlines, rudolf, are a proof that a job is passing through many hands.
each agency shortens the delivery time for a day, for example, and there is no sign that agencies trim the methodology with end user (schedules, daily outputs, etc.), because the end client is on a very distant end of the affair.
also, accepting tight schedules from end client, might suggest that he is hugely blackmailed with a high tariff for urgency.
it is very common that there are at least 2 agencies in front of a end client.
make a calculation on the fly, like this:
100: 1,50 = 64,52: 1,50 = 43 for a free-lance external translator.
(1,50 is a profit of 50%) the calculation is optimistic, because single profits are mostly higher.
the above "43" for a free-lance translator, as well as profits, as said, are variable downwards.
dragomir
| | | | wonita (X)
China
Local time: 02:40
Since the beginning of this year, I've received tons of applications from translators for all language pairs. Quite some, including those with over 10-years' experience, offer rates like 0.06, 0.07 USD per word.
I can't help wondering: when are they going to look for another job?
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