| Pages in topic: [1 2] > | Poor old Trados! Thread poster: MartinPorto
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MartinPorto 
Portugal
Local time: 03:23
French to English
+ ...
I have been a forum fan for some time, and have noticed poor old Trados gets a real bashing!
I try to read all the answers to posts, and a pattern emerges. The problem is often with other software, settings or configuration in general. Trados like any other software is not without its problems, but it's not exactly notepad is it? It is complex, the settings and installation may appear overwhelming. But!
There seems to be a trend in that, people often bash Trados, or other CAT tools f... See more I have been a forum fan for some time, and have noticed poor old Trados gets a real bashing!
I try to read all the answers to posts, and a pattern emerges. The problem is often with other software, settings or configuration in general. Trados like any other software is not without its problems, but it's not exactly notepad is it? It is complex, the settings and installation may appear overwhelming. But!
There seems to be a trend in that, people often bash Trados, or other CAT tools for that matter, without first having had a good look at other potential sources of errors (human error) etc.
After working for many years in IT, and was always amazed at how poorly configured most PCs were! Being a translator does not mean being an IT wiz! So I can easily imagine just how many poorly configured systems, are trying to cope with the likes of Trados and other demanding applications, setting things up correctly is paramount to good stability and performance.
I have Studio 2009 on a couple of machines, with no problems at all. The systems are stable, and performance is good. So, maybe we should not always blame what appears to be the obvious culprit, and just dig a little deeper! ▲ Collapse
| | | | Jaroslaw Michalak
Poland
Local time: 04:23
Member (2004)
English to Polish
SITE LOCALIZER | Poor Trados users... | Jan 3, 2012 |
MartinPorto wrote:
I have been a forum fan for some time, and have noticed poor old Trados gets a real bashing!
I try to read all the answers to posts, and a pattern emerges. The problem is often with other software, settings or configuration in general.
As you said, translators should not be required to be IT specialists. If I install ten packages on my "poorly configured" system and out of the ten only one consistently crashes with no apparent reason, then it is natural that I will blame that one piece of poorly written software. The argument that Trados runs well on pristine systems is absurd. Software should be able to run on real systems - nobody will buy a separate computer just to run Trados...
It certainly does not help that over the years Trados users were blamed by the support and, sadly, by fellow translators, for glaring deficiencies of the program. I am interested in software and had quite a few programs dependent on Java - Trados was the only one which required a very specific version to run... And how many times we were told that disappearing formats were the result of bad use of Word and that we should educate our clients (!) about that - even though all other CATs managed to render them properly... Even lately I've seen people rebuked when they complained that they lost old Trados/Multiterm compatibility, only because they did not follow the procedure: "install this, deinstall that, then install that other thing, but only after you have installed that something... etc."
Naturally, Studio is infinitely better than old Trados, but it still is a kind of Frankensoft, patched up from various chunks of various quality. Which means it will never be as stable as software written from scratch.
By the way, out of maybe twenty last threads posted here six state that a certain part of the software fails to run at all! Naturally, this is probably the users' fault as they were stupid enough to try to use their computers for something beside Trados, but it is still not very encouraging.
[Edited at 2012-01-03 21:53 GMT]
| | | | Jerzy Czopik
Germany
Local time: 04:23
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
| I am indeed frustrated.... | Jan 3, 2012 |
Jabberwock wrote:
...
It certainly does not help that over the years Trados users were blamed by the support and, sadly, by fellow translators, for glaring deficiencies of the program. I am interested in software and had quite a few programs dependent on Java - Trados was the only one which required a very specific version to run... And how many times we were told that disappearing formats were the result of bad use of Word and that we should educate our clients (!) about that - even though all other CATs managed to render them properly... Even lately I've seen people rebuked when they complained that they lost old Trados/Multiterm compatibility, only because they did not follow the procedure: "install this, deinstall that, then install that other thing, but only after you have installed that something... etc."
...
Seems that I am one of those bad guys...
Nevertheless I still would say, that the majority of the problems does arise from bad use of either the tool itself or of bad format of the source files.
Within the last ten years I did not have even 20% of all the problems reported and my system is everything else than "pristine" (whatever that may matter, my dictionary does not help me here ). I use a PC with originally Windows Vista Home Premium 64 installed. On that system I have installed all betas for Studio 2009, then installed Windows 7 HP 64 over that. Finally I changed Win7 HP to Win7 Ultimate and installed all the betas for Studio 2011. And it works, despite all this irresponsible actions.
IMHO nowadays translators indeed do need to be at least quite IT literate, as PC is our main tool. So it is not misplaced to expect us to know how to use this tool. Would some people reporting problems be aware of that, some (many) problems could have been avoided.
| | | | Jaroslaw Michalak
Poland
Local time: 04:23
Member (2004)
English to Polish
SITE LOCALIZER
Jerzy Czopik wrote:
Nevertheless I still would say, that the majority of the problems does arise from bad use of either the tool itself or of bad format of the source files.
The question here is what you consider "bad use". For me that is doing something which is completely out of line, like deleting configuration files, trying to move program files etc. From what I read, most users with problems were just doing their jobs. If they do it differently than Trados engineers imagined, then I tend to blame the lack of imagination.
Besides, well written software should be (reasonably) resistant to human error. That is, even in extreme cases it should respond "Excuse me, but you seem to have misplaced your configuration files. Would you like to have them restored now?", not crash without a word.
Within the last ten years I did not have even 20% of all the problems reported
And I know two people who smoked all their life and they are perfectly fine... does that prove anything? Or, to stick to your favorite automotive analogies: if the automaker finds out that one in ten thousand engines catches fire out of the blue, they recall them off. They do not tell the drivers to drive better...
During the first two days of use my Studio 2009 crashed four times. Even though I know the reason (my unfavorable postings here and a generally hostile attitude), I guess that about evens out the statistics? (To be fair, 2011 has not crashed on me yet.)
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Oliver Walter
United Kingdom
Local time: 03:23
German to English
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| Danger of smoking | Jan 3, 2012 |
Jabberwock wrote:
And I know two people who smoked all their life and they are perfectly fine... does that prove anything?
Well, yes, and this won't surprise you: it proves that smoking doesn't guarantee cancer. Of course, nobody said it does - it just increases the probability, so it will actually cause cancer in some smokers and not in others.
(In other words, I support your views on Trados in general, from my position of never having installed Trados but having owned personal computers for about 30 years.)
| | | | | Indeed, PCs can be so misconfigured... | Jan 4, 2012 |
...and yet, other complex CAT tools around do not have the amount of problems Trados has. How do you explain that?
| | | | | No reason to complain | Jan 4, 2012 |
I started with Trados 3 many years back and have been using Trados since. I cannot confirm that Trados is more buggy than other software (the early versions of 2009 being an exception). I love it (Trados 2009 and soon Trados 2011). It allows me to handle formats that I could not handle before.
I do believe that there are several reasons why you won't find a lot (if any) forum posts from me complaining about so called Trados errors or deficiencies:
a) I am not an early ... See more I started with Trados 3 many years back and have been using Trados since. I cannot confirm that Trados is more buggy than other software (the early versions of 2009 being an exception). I love it (Trados 2009 and soon Trados 2011). It allows me to handle formats that I could not handle before.
I do believe that there are several reasons why you won't find a lot (if any) forum posts from me complaining about so called Trados errors or deficiencies:
a) I am not an early adopter, i. e. I wait a bit after a new version is released before i buy it.
b) I payed for some training and participated in free Trados webinars
c) I do not expect to use the software without ever checking the user manual or help system
d) In the rare cases (< 1 year) I ran into problems, I contacted Trados support (no I don't have a paid Trados support contract) and I was always amazed how fast and competent I received help/support
There are several other tools I tried - but up to now, I did not find any that convinced me to switch.
across seems to be a nice system, but it is a closed system and does not really fit in our workflow.
MemoQ seems to be a very good system, but I have not yet tried the latest version (previous versions did not convince me).
I won't work with online systems that don't allow me to feed my own TM and that won't allow me to keep a version of what I translated for traceability reasons (ie. I want to be able to proof what I translated and/or that my translation was errorfree when sending it to the customer).
I don't work with systems that don't come with a lot of file filters.
I have no requirement to run the software on a Mac or Linux system.
Therefore, unless I find some time to test the latest MemoQ which might convince me to switch I'll stick with Trados. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Heinrich Pesch
Finland
Local time: 05:23
Member (2003)
Finnish to German
+ ...
| I would not blame users either | Jan 4, 2012 |
The proportion of SDL-Trados/Studio related postings speaks for itself. I have no statistics on how many percent of us use the one or other tool, but it seems significantly more complain about SDL-products than any other brand. But I remember with old Wordfast we hat these fora on Yahoo, and knowledgeable people answered swiftly to all inquiries. Getting Wordfast running under Word was not easy for many of us. But back then Wordfast was so much cheaper than TRados, that we did not complain too m... See more The proportion of SDL-Trados/Studio related postings speaks for itself. I have no statistics on how many percent of us use the one or other tool, but it seems significantly more complain about SDL-products than any other brand. But I remember with old Wordfast we hat these fora on Yahoo, and knowledgeable people answered swiftly to all inquiries. Getting Wordfast running under Word was not easy for many of us. But back then Wordfast was so much cheaper than TRados, that we did not complain too much. ▲ Collapse
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neilmac
Spain
Local time: 04:23
Spanish to English
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| More than just the software | Jan 4, 2012 |
Tomás Cano Binder, CT wrote:
...and yet, other complex CAT tools around do not have the amount of problems Trados has. How do you explain that?
And we are still waiting for a reply. As I have posted in my several rants on the topic, it is more than just the technical aspect that puts me off, it is the whole "ethos" surrounding it. I don`t think I need go into more detail as my views are widely known, if not always shared. Even one friend who is a long-term Trados user admits it is a pain in the... neck.
| | | | MartinPorto
Portugal
Local time: 03:23
French to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Maybe the amount of complaints about Trados, simply reflect the market share they claim to enjoy! Some of the coments I made, have been misunderstood, I never claimed Trados was without its bugs!
| | | | Laurent KRAULAND (X)
France
Local time: 04:23
French to German
+ ...
| With you on that... | Jan 4, 2012 |
neilmac wrote: Tomás Cano Binder, CT wrote:
...and yet, other complex CAT tools around do not have the amount of problems Trados has. How do you explain that? And we are still waiting for a reply. As I have posted in my several rants on the topic, it is more than just the technical aspect that puts me off, it is the whole "ethos" surrounding it. I don`t think I need go into more detail as my views are widely known, if not always shared. Even one friend who is a long-term Trados user admits it is a pain in the... neck.
I have some misgivings about the ethos too. And maybe trados doesn't like me for that - which is not the case for my current configuration!
| | | | | Statistically... | Jan 4, 2012 |
MartinPorto wrote:
Maybe the amount of complaints about Trados, simply reflect the market share they claim to enjoy! Some of the coments I made, have been misunderstood, I never claimed Trados was without its bugs!
The problem is not "how much complaints" (of course, Trados has more users than other tools, so obviously the amount of complaints will be always bigger...) but "what kind of complaints" Trados users do.
Some time ago I posted here some rough comparisons of the subjects.
Trados was visibly overrepresented in the categories like "the setup fails", "my license is not recognized" or "the terminology doesn't work".
In these very basic terms, Trados seems a crap if compared to other tools.
During the last 8 years, my Déjà Vu X got corrupt 2 (two) times, memoQ got badly corrupt 1 (one) time during 3 years, the Trados repair number I performed is close to infinity.
Why damn the Multiterm guys created program menu items like "Repair Multiterm whatever"?
None of the CAT tools I'm aware proudly presents an option like that...
The answer is "Multiterm doesn't work", so the "bashing" is just a sad reality...
Cheers
GG
[Edited at 2012-01-05 02:25 GMT]
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Pavel Tsvetkov
Bulgaria
Local time: 05:23
Member (2008)
English to Bulgarian
+ ...
MODERATOR | A separate machine for Trados | Jan 5, 2012 |
Jabberwock wrote:
As you said, translators should not be required to be IT specialists. If I install ten packages on my "poorly configured" system and out of the ten only one consistently crashes with no apparent reason, then it is natural that I will blame that one piece of poorly written software. The argument that Trados runs well on pristine systems is absurd. Software should be able to run on real systems - nobody will buy a separate computer just to run Trados...
My point exactly.
It has often been the case that when I posted problems with v2009 the same people would come forward and helpfully inform me that "this has never happened" to them, or that I am to blame, because obviously I have other software installed, and not just Trados and Windows.
To me that is an absurd statement and if everything else (with very few exceptions) is able to coexist peacefully on the same machine - but Trados isn't - this is bad software engineering on the side of SDL.
I have been paying for licenses for the last 4 years, so do not come tell me it is my fault the software does not work. Make it work.
With all due respect, with the number of problems Trados has had in recent years - and especially critical ones (like not being able to export your translation from inside the program) - their support should be offered for free, as everybody seems to need it on a daily basis.
You cannot be selling software that constantly crashes and at the same time be selling support packages. Or release new versions before the old one has actually become stable on real machines.
It is just not fair to customers, who have been helping you with their money to run your business all along.
Kind Regards,
PTS
| | | | | | Neil Coffey
United Kingdom
Local time: 03:23
French to English
+ ...
| Where is the need for intricate PC configuration...? | Jan 6, 2012 |
MartinPorto wrote:
After working for many years in IT, and was always amazed at how poorly configured most PCs were! Being a translator does not mean being an IT wiz! So I can easily imagine just how many poorly configured systems, are trying to cope with the likes of Trados and other demanding applications, setting things up correctly is paramount to good stability and performance.
Mmmm maybe I'm missing something here, but as a programmer I'm trying to rack my brains and think why the functionality of an MT tool is in principle so terribly complex that it should require some special intricate PC configuration in order to work???
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