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Kudoz - Had enough
Thread poster: Natalia Eklund
neilmac
neilmac
Spain
Local time: 15:02
Spanish to English
+ ...
You rang? Mar 17, 2019

tom_michell wrote:
My suggestion is that, once the program is up and running, there should be options within Kudoz to only send/receive questions to/from the 'certified pro' members.

One problem with this that would need looking at is the fact that some of the most knowledgeable site users are not paying members and are therefore excluded from the program ...


I often get quite frustrated when I have an answer to a query, but the asker's stipulates that only prozers claiming to specialise in a certain area (or paid up/certified members) can answer the question. I used to be a paying member, but as kudoz and the forums are really the only things I use proz for, it seemed a rather fruitless expense, so I let it lapse. However, despite not paying the tithe, I think I'm still as good/bad/indifferent at my job as I was while shelling out the filthy lucre...


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Katalin Horváth McClure
Katalin Horváth McClure  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 10:02
Member (2002)
English to Hungarian
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You can still post an answer, no? Mar 17, 2019

neilmac wrote:

I often get quite frustrated when I have an answer to a query, but the asker's stipulates that only prozers claiming to specialise in a certain area (or paid up/certified members) can answer the question.

Maybe things changed recently, but as far as I remember, those stipulations are not hard blocks. If you try to answer, I think you get a pop-up message saying you do not meet the criteria, but you can still offer an asnwer, if you want, and then you can click to continue with your answer, no? Or is it only for questions that are not in your language pairs?


 
writeaway
writeaway  Identity Verified
French to English
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Ordinary mortals cannot answer if an asker stipulates paying members only Mar 18, 2019

Katalin Horváth McClure wrote:

neilmac wrote:

I often get quite frustrated when I have an answer to a query, but the asker's stipulates that only prozers claiming to specialise in a certain area (or paid up/certified members) can answer the question.

Maybe things changed recently, but as far as I remember, those stipulations are not hard blocks. If you try to answer, I think you get a pop-up message saying you do not meet the criteria, but you can still offer an asnwer, if you want, and then you can click to continue with your answer, no? Or is it only for questions that are not in your language pairs?


People can answer if they don't claim to work in the language pair or in the field, but when an asker stipulates that only paying members can answer, then others are not able to answer or post peer comments. The Dbox remains the only option.
Imo, it's not as dramatic as it would have been in the past because nowadays Kudoz questions are too often just a substitute for doing one's own work or an escape route for those who took on jobs they never should have accepted in the first place.


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Ehssan Abou Daoud
Ehssan Abou Daoud  Identity Verified
United Arab Emirates
Local time: 18:02
Member (2019)
English to Arabic
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Had Enough TOO! May 1, 2019

I had enough of people who receive a translation task and ask about every term in their task! If you are not good in, let's say, Legal translation, and have to ask about each and every term you come across, why on earth do you apply or quote legal jobs with a very low price and prevent others who are good in Legal translation, who really deserve to get the job, from getting it!? Those people are an embarrassment to the translation industry and should be banned from using Kudoz! Translators shoul... See more
I had enough of people who receive a translation task and ask about every term in their task! If you are not good in, let's say, Legal translation, and have to ask about each and every term you come across, why on earth do you apply or quote legal jobs with a very low price and prevent others who are good in Legal translation, who really deserve to get the job, from getting it!? Those people are an embarrassment to the translation industry and should be banned from using Kudoz! Translators should be allowed to post on Kudoz for once or twice a day max.
In my language pair (English-Arabic), you see the same person sometimes post on Kudoz 10 times a day about the same task they're doing! Something has to be done about that...
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Katalin Horváth McClure
Katalin Horváth McClure  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 10:02
Member (2002)
English to Hungarian
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Stop answering - that's all you can do May 1, 2019

Ehssan Abou Daoud wrote:

In my language pair (English-Arabic), you see the same person sometimes post on Kudoz 10 times a day about the same task they're doing! Something has to be done about that...


Stop answering those questions. I suspect the person keeps coming back and keeps doing this because there is always someone helping. You can choose to help, or not. The more specialists realize this person is effectively a leech and stop supplying the blood, the more chances are the leech will fall off.


Adam Warren
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DZiW (X)
DZiW (X)
Ukraine
English to Russian
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a fresh eye May 1, 2019

There're many multi-context phrases in specific projects, requiring intensive/extensive research. I occasionally have to double-check several sources or ask a few colleagues to have a look at it, sharing the views. Why, I see nothing wrong with asking my clients too.

As everything else, I consider KudoZ answers as suppositions or assumptions, yet they also may give a clue.


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Gregory Lassale
Gregory Lassale  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 09:02
English to French
Funny May 18, 2019

Just the other day, I was thinking about how flawed on one hand, and gamed on the other, kudoz is. Sure there must be a few threads about it somewhere, I thought. I don't usually peruse the forum, but this morning I did and here it is. Yes, there are many many issues with how the system works, and how people - askers and answerers alike - use it.

On paper, the peer system sounds like a good idea...but in order to work correctly, it requires the participation of peers that are 1) co
... See more
Just the other day, I was thinking about how flawed on one hand, and gamed on the other, kudoz is. Sure there must be a few threads about it somewhere, I thought. I don't usually peruse the forum, but this morning I did and here it is. Yes, there are many many issues with how the system works, and how people - askers and answerers alike - use it.

On paper, the peer system sounds like a good idea...but in order to work correctly, it requires the participation of peers that are 1) competent, 2) fair and objective and 3) maybe try to mostly keep to their area(s) of specialty? I've seen bad reading comprehension errors made by otherwise experienced translators, which of couse in turn result in faulty attribution of agrees/disagrees. I've seen people agree with poor, word-for-word, literal translations when idiomatic ways to translate it are available, and bash "total extrapolations" that absolutely respect the essence of the source text. Go figure. And no, I'm not talking about *my* answers here. Human nature being what it is, you can't escape people trashing others' suggestions because, well, sour grapes. Oh, you disagreed with me here? I'll knock you down a peg there. Petty, but sadly predictable.

Another problem is that questions are like the latest big news headline. Everyone will chime in for a bit, and then stop when it's no longer fresh and interesting to them, even if more answers come in. Coupled with the fact that people almost never agree with more than one suggestion even if a better one is made later on, and that essentially results in an "early bird catches the worm" type effect. Whoever is quickest in making an O.K. to good suggestion will usually rack up thumb ups and, in the end, the kudos points. Sucks for you - and in the end and more importantly, for the opinion the askers will form of the suggestions given - if you're late to the party. There's a small window of opportunity, and too bad for you if you miss it, no matter the quality of your answer.

Of course some answerers and point hunters sort of game the system in a multitude of ways, from minor loopholes to more reprehensible tactics. A few off the top of my head:

- Piling on several answers into one: I suggest "this/that/or this/or that". 4 answers into one to cover as much ground as possible.
- Give themselves a high level of certainly (5) no matter what. Why not give yourself a head start if you can help it, eh? I've seen great answers where shy contributors rated their suggestions a 2 or 3, and poor ones rated 4 or 5. Of all the flaws, this is the one that perhaps the easiest to fix. Everyone starts with 0, and goes up or down from there. Why ask people to rate themselves when. pay-off is involved?
- Using a suggestion given in a discussion post by a peer.
- Ever so slightly mirroring another's suggestion.

Askers are totally not free of blame either. I don't understand why some get themselves off the hook by leaving it up to the community to decide on the best answer. Don't do that. That directly plays into all the system flaws listed above. You asked the question, so pick the answer that *you* like most, whether you end up using it or not. Yes, the decision will still be subjective, but at least it will the asker's subjectivity, not the bias of people battling for kudos and ego points.
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Mirko Mainardi
Mirko Mainardi  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 15:02
Member
English to Italian
Generally agree, but... May 18, 2019

Gregory Lassale wrote:

Askers are totally not free of blame either. I don't understand why some get themselves off the hook by leaving it up to the community to decide on the best answer. Don't do that. That directly plays into all the system flaws listed above. You asked the question, so pick the answer that *you* like most, whether you end up using it or not. Yes, the decision will still be subjective, but at least it will the asker's subjectivity, not the bias of people battling for kudos and ego points.


Yeah, but the main reason for asking a question is that you don't know the answer... so how can the asker "decide on the best answer"? And I fear just "liking" it is often not a good enough reason...

And besides, in that case we could simply do away with agrees and "confidence" ratings and leave everything to the asker...

As for the "late to the party" argument, you're perfectly right, and in fact some users post replies as fast as they can, with multiple answers, zero references, "." as an "explanation", etc. in order to maximize their chances of raking in agrees... but how do you counter that? A solution could perhaps be to wait X minutes/hours after the question has been posted before making publishing answers, but that would go against the asker's interests (in getting a reply ASAP)...


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Gregory Lassale
Gregory Lassale  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 09:02
English to French
not for points May 18, 2019

If they truly have zero clue, maybe not-for-pointing the question is a better approach. But from what I see, askers often do understand the meaning of the term but just can't quite find a satisfactory way to translate it. In those cases, they are very well able to determine which answer(s) fits into the source text best.

[Edited at 2019-05-18 20:00 GMT]

[Edited at 2019-05-19 13:09 GMT]


 
jyuan_us
jyuan_us  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 10:02
Member (2005)
English to Chinese
+ ...
"not for points" is misunderstood by some askers May 19, 2019

These askers are trying to be modest by choosing "not for points" because they don't want to earn any point for asking a question.

This is my observation, which may not be necessarily true.

[Edited at 2019-05-19 12:34 GMT]


P.L.F. Persio
 
Gregory Lassale
Gregory Lassale  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 09:02
English to French
Irritating May 24, 2019

Just came across a question where an answerer piled on 4 answers in one. So aggravating.

 
Aminata Diabi
Aminata Diabi  Identity Verified
Canada
Local time: 10:02
English to French
It's about doing the right thing Jun 6, 2019

I fully agree. Some really don't have any clue and sometimes don't even bother to make proper research before asking.
They just go ask instead of looking for it themselves. And when you help they don't even send points nor mere thank you
I think I 'll just stop answering the whole thing is just so frustrating.



Katalin Horváth McClure wrote:

Ehssan Abou Daoud wrote:

In my language pair (English-Arabic), you see the same person sometimes post on Kudoz 10 times a day about the same task they're doing! Something has to be done about that...


Stop answering those questions. I suspect the person keeps coming back and keeps doing this because there is always someone helping. You can choose to help, or not. The more specialists realize this person is effectively a leech and stop supplying the blood, the more chances are the leech will fall off.


Anne Maclennan
 
Gregory Lassale
Gregory Lassale  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 09:02
English to French
Furthermore Jun 6, 2019

I really wonder about a translator's level of expertise in a given when they struggle with so many technical terms. You have to wonder... for every question someone asks on here because google couldn't help, how many did they have that a google search did solve ?

Don't get me wrong, it's going to be rare - if not impossible - for one person to know every single technical term in a given field, but there has to be a point where one can no longer considered a "specialist". So when I
... See more
I really wonder about a translator's level of expertise in a given when they struggle with so many technical terms. You have to wonder... for every question someone asks on here because google couldn't help, how many did they have that a google search did solve ?

Don't get me wrong, it's going to be rare - if not impossible - for one person to know every single technical term in a given field, but there has to be a point where one can no longer considered a "specialist". So when I see this many qs in a row, the first thing that goes through my mind is "how on earth did they get the job??". I mean, almost every single job posting I see out there asks for X number years of experience translating in this or that... I thought today's translators were supposed to be specialists in their fields of practice? I'm a bit confused...
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Robert Rietvelt
Robert Rietvelt  Identity Verified
Local time: 15:02
Member (2006)
Spanish to Dutch
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True, but..... Jun 7, 2019

Gregory Lassale wrote:

.....I really wonder about a translator's level of expertise in a given when they struggle with so many technical terms.....

....I thought today's translators were supposed to be specialists in their fields of practice? I'm a bit confused...


In some cases the client comes up with selfmade words (zero hits on Google). Technical German for example is notorious for it. Imaginary words, some as long as a whole sentence, and poor me struggling finding a way how to translate it to Dutch.

In those cases I can do with a little help of my (Kudoz)friends.


P.L.F. Persio
 
Juan Jacob
Juan Jacob  Identity Verified
Mexico
Local time: 08:02
French to Spanish
+ ...
Askers often with Jun 7, 2019

2.000, even more than 7.000 questions in one case, a lot without grading and open, zero answers... I know them well. Don't even look at the question... always basic ones, BTW. Not translators, of course.

Anne Maclennan
P.L.F. Persio
 
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Kudoz - Had enough






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